Choke light on, charge guage low.

[Slacker]

So my choke light started coming on and staying on the other day and I noticed my charge guage isn't reading the normal 13.5v but more 11v steady. (Regardless on engine load).

The contacts to the alt and battery are clean. I'm going to be testing the alternator tomorrow to see if it's outputting the correct voltage.

My question is, how are these two symptoms related? There's no SES codes either.

I could understand if my choke wasn't working and the engine was running at a really low RPM, but the car drives exactly how it did before the light came on.

Any ideas?

[Techfizzle]

never seen a choke ligh on a car

[Pontiac6ksteawd]

Yes the 2 are related, and connected beleive it or not. Get your alt fixed, and it should your problem.

[dcjredline]

Slacker, remember the important part about the charging is the Current (Amps) not the voltage.

[85_Ciera_Rebuild]

never seen a choke ligh on a car

I've got two Chevies with a choke light...wanna buy one of them...1982/1986...better fuel mileage than a SUV.

[CieraSL92]

never seen a choke light on a car

Lots and LOTS of carb'd cars had them.

[Duke George V]

never seen a choke light on a car
Mine has one and it's fuel injected.

[Pontiac6ksteawd]

I think all the Celebs had a choke light. Just in 87 the wiring for it was no longer used. One of the other members wired his choke light to be a alarm light I think, or it might have been a shift light.

[87Cutlass Ciera]

never seen a choke ligh on a car

The Cutlass Ciera's with the Dummy lights have a place for a choke light. If you were to take the cluster out and hold it up to the light, you would see it says "Choke" and it's Yellow, but there is no light in there and it's not wired up. Actually, none of the lights are used up there, I even tried to use the Temp and Amps, but it didn't work... I know the Cluster from the Cruiser has lights for Tailgate Ajar and a few others too, but thats cause it's a full cluster.

[bpogi]

Hmm. My '87 Cutlass Ciera has all the idiot lights hooked up and working (except, obviously, the choke light).

[Jimbo]

Yep I've got a choke light and it's RED. Goes on when the car stalls.

[Slacker]

Yes the 2 are related, and connected beleive it or not. Get your alt fixed, and it should your problem.

So if the alternator is on the way out, the choke will work incorrectly? This seems like a strange spaghetti string of wirings. lol.

Also, I noticed that the car is stuck in high idle. I can manually use the levers on the back of the carb to open the choke all the way, but once I move the throttle... it kicks right back on to high idle. (ie: choke not all the way open). Can this also be related?


Slacker, remember the important part about the charging is the Current (Amps) not the voltage.

Thanks, that would probably explain why I haven't had a dead battery yet. *knocks on pressboard desk*

[turbokinetic]

On most of these that I've seen, the "CHOKE" light was also a low oil pressure warning. It sent power to the choke actuator (heater) only when the engine was running (has oil pressure). The choke system is not working, and that is causing your high idle problem. The choke actuator is temperature sensative, and it slowly opens the choke and lowers the idle as the engine warms up, but it requires electrical power to do it.

The reason they warn you about the choke is that it will make the engine run rich and possible set the catalytic converter on fire!

The 2 may be related, let me do some diggin!

[turbokinetic]

OK Found it.

http://68.209.87.173/Temp/1984_celeb_wiring.PNG

The alternator does indeed control the choke heater circuit, as the diagram above shows. Check the C/H and Gauges fuses. Then if that is not it, look to the alternator!

Hope this helps!
David

[Slacker]

Wow! Excellent info! Thanks a lot!

I'll check those out.

Quick question. There's a wire that's connector is snapped and 1/2 is exposed. (looks chunky and is in need of cleaning). When I unplug it, the choke light on the dash goes off but the problem still remains. That must be the wire to the choke heater... why would the light go off if it's unplugged though? ...I'm thinking it should be the other way around...

[turbokinetic]

When you turn on the key, battery voltage (B+) is connected to the "CHOKE" lightbulb on 1 wire. The other wire is connected to the choke heater. Current flows from B+, through the ignition switch, light bulb, choke heater, and to Ground. You have B+ on one side of the bulb (through the ignition switch) and Ground on the other side of the bulb (through the choke heater) so the bulb has + and Ground and it illuminates. If you disconnect the choke heater, this breaks the ground and turns off the lightbulb. It does not make the Choke actuator open up the choke or slow the idle and you might still burn up the catalutic converter.

Now, when the alternator is charging, and the choke heater is ON, it all changes. You still have B+ coming from the battery through the ignition switch to the "CHOKE" light one one wire. The other wire is connected to the choke heater, but now the choke heater is also connected to B+ through the relay. Your "CHOKE" lightbulb has B+ on both wires, there is no current flow because there is the same voltage on both wires.

Seriously, it both the fuses are good, check the alternator. Especially if the voltmeter is showing low voltage. The car can run for days on a fully charged battery before the battery is depleted. This car has very few electrical loads, being carburetor. If you turned off everything but the ignition, and started driving with no alternator on a full battery, you could probably drive 10 or more hours before the ignition drained the battery.

Just because the battery hasn't run out of steam yet doesn't mean the alternator is working.

Good luck!
David

[Slacker]

Turbo, you hit the nail on the head with this one. Tested the alt and it was definitely toast. I picked up a new one, the choke light went off, charging went back to normal. Car seems to be driving better than before. (I guess the alt was on its way out longer than I thought lol)

Quick question though, the new alt is getting wayyy too hot. It's VERY hot to the touch, even after a short drive. I read that this could be from it over working... but what could possibly be causing this if my car ran fine w/o a working alt all together? How much work could it possibly be doing? I don't see any external shorts and only touched the two wires that go to the alt. (The one plug and the one screwed on pin). I'm not sure what's going on here...

Any ideas?

[Pontiac6ksteawd]

Go get your battery checked at a parts store, or something like that. If it has a cell going bad, or if the battery is plainly going bad, the alternator will toast itself in very short order.

[turbokinetic]

The alternator is working very hard to replenish the battery. Your battery was partially run-down because it was running the car for a couple days without being kept up by the alternator.

If this condition continues it can ruin the alternator, but probably the battery will get fully charged before this happens. Keep the electrical loads such as A/C turned off; and also minimize idling which causes the air under the hood to get hot.

If it didn't burn out the alternator in the first hour or two it will be fine!
David

[Slacker]

Hmm.. you might be right again.

Drove it back and forth to work today and it was hot again, but so was everything else. I won't say it was any hotter than the rest of the engine. Drove it again tonight (It's pretty cool out) and it didn't seem to get hot.

I guess time will tell. If it doesn't blow in a week, I'll start trusting it. lol :D

[dcjredline]

Instead of going to get it checked FOR FREE your going to just drive around and hope?

[CieraSL92]

Alt's run hot. Unless you have enough experience with them it's impossible to tell by the case's temperature.