i knew they'd show up on ebay sometime...

[Tonglebeak]

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=160155982832&ssPageName=STRK:MEWN:IT&ih=006

HELL YEAH!

ALRIGHT, what else am I going to need now that I got the meat of the rear brake system?

This if for converting the rear drums to rear discs. Obviously I'll need to get rear rotors and pads @_@, what else is going to be needed now that I got those calipers?

[Pontiac6ksteawd]

Once you get the rotors and pads, I think theres only 2 things left. One is some banjo washers, (posibly) the rear rubber brake hoses, (posibly) the rear e-brake cables. You would have to ask MickStan for sure thou. I cant seem to remember if there is a diference.

[Tonglebeak]

Thanks. I don't remember anything about the setup since the old forums were wiped :(

[Tonglebeak]

Banjo washer/bolts: these?
http://www.autozone.com/N,14401009//shopping/partTypeResultSet.htm

Brake hoses: this?
http://www.autozone.com/N,14400766//shopping/partTypeResultSet.htm

Can't find anything for an e-brake cable though :(

Any special tools needed for this?

[dcjredline]

So whats your plans with them, you gonna try a rear disc conversion?

You best start some pictures for the NEW forums!

[Tonglebeak]

That's the plan. Nice to have you back :)

[dcjredline]

Glad to be back, and I HOPE we can have our SEPARATE opinions and still all get along.

For the record I don't hate ya and never did.

[Tonglebeak]

I know. I actually defended you when the big event happened at the old forums. You were given the death sentence for stealing cookies, IMO.

:\ I'm definitely cool with you though.

[dcjredline]

:cool: Good lookin out then man. It feels good to hear. A few others also showed theyre support and that made me feel a little better.

I am going to TONE DOWN (just a little) so we can ENJOY this place again!

[notsoslimshady76]

:-D

[dcjredline]

Sorry to go OFF TOPIC already.

I am looking for some for the Blue STE I bought in July. You can get the Rotors on rock auto for like $35 each. The cheapest I have found them anywhere.

[Tonglebeak]

I got mine off ebay yesterday.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=260066504889&ssPageName=STRK:MEWA:IT&ih=016

~$20 for the set. Hopefully they're not made out of plastic!

[dcjredline]

DAMN! Good deal. The 88's are different than the 89's anyway. 89's are MORE! BUT I did save $10 each just now. Advance Auto lists rear 89 rotors for $24 each! WOO HOOO!

Now if I can only get one of them running.

[Tonglebeak]

:)

[Pontiac6ksteawd]

Speaking of getting it running. I had an idea about that. Start a thread asking for help, listing what you have done, and we can go from there..

[SexySilhouette]

I am definitely going to add 4 wheel discs on the Silhouette...Gots to have good stopping power!

[Tonglebeak]

Can anyone confirm the parts that I need? Also, please see post #4

[dcjredline]

You need backing plates and if those are the ones listed for the 88 6k then yeah thats the ones. You MAY need to adapt them. Prolly want a proportioning valve from the disc cars too.

[skalor]

Do you have the backing plates that hold the calipers??

[Tonglebeak]

... :( I didn't know about backing plates :(

[Tonglebeak]

Guess I have to ask, anyone got any backing plates for this? >_>

[CieraSL92]

The backing plates are held on with like four torx bolts. No biggie.

I would go to the junkyard for backing plates (and to get a decent look at how this works) I have not seen them listed online. If you want, for whatever reason, you can go to the dealer-but expect to be raped.

A proportioning valve will ensure the rear's are getting a nominal about of brake pressure, too much will cause the wheels to lock. You might be able to get away without it though. I want to say that drums would require more brake pressure to produce to what a disc could get with less pressure. But I don't have firsthand experience with that.

[mickstan_VR]

You will not need the proportioning valve. The stock JA2 master cylinder is used on both types, drums and discs. You will need a different ebrake cable though. The one from the drum type setup wont work. Heres the link to conversion process: http://www.cardomain.com/ride/805391/21 . Its a pretty easy job, just give yourself 2 full days to get it done. Minor issues will arise along the way. The ebrake cables are a PITA. Initial adjustment is frustrating, and getting ALL of the air out of the calipers takes some time and a couple of bottles of brake fluid.
It IS worth it though! You will be very impressed with how they function. Smooth as silk.

[Tonglebeak]

Ok cool. Just want to clarify here:

By "rear brake lines" you mean the this correct?
http://www.autozone.com/N,14400766//shopping/partTypeResultSet.htm

And someone earlier mentioned something about banjo bolts. They're not required then?

EDIT: GRRR 242332q48rfxzd fjsafKLSDFSA az and advanced don't have the hoses. I got everything else though.

[dcjredline]

Yeah you will need banjo bolts they hold the hose into the caliper.

[Tonglebeak]

Gotcha.

Will front hoses work for the rears by some chance O_o

I went to napa parts online and everytime I click on "brake hose rear" it sends me to the "brake hose right front" page.

[Pontiac6ksteawd]

I am not finding the hose on Autozones zite either. I will keep searching. But no, the front brake hose will not work. Wrong length, and the bends are completely wrong.

[Tonglebeak]

I went to AZ and Advanced today and was told by both that they don't have any. So I went to napa's online site but it keeps redirecting me to the right front hose. @_@

[dcjredline]

Try Rock Auto. They are going to be HARD to come by let me tell ya. There werent many A's made with red disc.

[Tonglebeak]

hang on...

Never used rockauto before. Before I buy this, can someone confirm this is what I need?
http://img250.imageshack.us/img250/686/hosescw4.jpg

[mickstan_VR]

I can't read it! Are you doing your searchs for an '86 STE? Thats the car you need the parts from. It will all interchange with your car. A new banjo bolt will come with the calipers.

[Tonglebeak]

No, I've been using an 88 STE, since my ciera is an 88.....

...........It HAS be an 86?

*prepares to punch a wall*

[mickstan_VR]

Yes. The '86 was NOT ABS. '87 and above is. The ABS stuff is different. You need the stuff from a 1986. Brake hoses should still be easily available. But you'll also need the short brake lines as seen in my photos. Those are harder to come by. You might have to make your own, or hit a junkyard to get them. I'm not sure if they are available from the part stores. Mine came from a junkyard and they are fine.

[Tonglebeak]

sfdafsfsfalkjsafjaslf;jsak;fjsalfjsa;lfjasfjslfksa klfjsdafsalf;

I got some apologizing/exchanging to do at AZ tomorrow -.- (I special ordered the e-brake cables...although it looks like the pads and rotors should still be fit).

What exactly do you mean by short brake lines (which picture in your walkthrough has what you're referring to)?

[mickstan_VR]

The metal tube brake lines. The hoses are rubber. And the ebrake cables you orderded should work, but I'm not 100% sure. Pads and rotors should be the same, but the calipers will be different. Its just easier to get it all for an '86 as ALL of that stuff

[Tonglebeak]

Alright. I'm just going to see if I can get that ordered cancelled and see about getting the 86 things.

You say the calipers are different? Here's a pic of the ones I ordered, please tell me they'll work :(

http://i2.ebayimg.com/02/i/000/b5/4b/097c_1.JPG

And is this the metal brake line you're talking aobut, circled in yellow? Sorry if I'm being annoying, I just want to be 100% of everything.

http://img460.imageshack.us/img460/692/805391201fullrm4.jpg

Can a place such as NAPA just cut a piece of brake line and stick some fittings on it?

[mickstan_VR]

OK, the calipers are different than the '86 ones I used. The part you circled is part of the hose. Look at a few photos above that one, the one with the caliper, rotor and backing plate laid out on the floor. The skinny line below those parts is the actual brake line. You can also see it in the 5th picture from the bottom, running along the side of the trailing arm, in the picture with the coil spring visible.
This project is simple, as long as you use the correct parts.

[mickstan_VR]

And no, you are not being annoying at all.........yet.lol! The only way to learn is to ask questions.

[Tonglebeak]

Oh boy, so my calipers won't work?

[dcjredline]

Well I did a little searching on the computer today at AZ and got the part #'s for the 87 and 88 too but looks like they wont work. Oh well.

The picture you posted looks alot like the pictures on the computer when I looked at the 87 rear hoses.

[Tonglebeak]

Dcj, do you know if AZ will accept a return for a special order? I'm not supposed to get the cables until tuesday, so can they just cancel it and refund me for it, and I'll try to see what they have for the '86 variety?

[dcjredline]

We cannot "cancel" the order. They will have to get the items and THEN refund you. You will be able to order the new parts. (I know thats expensive BUT)

I meant to reply to this on my last post WOOPS!

[Tonglebeak]

Oh ok. AFAIK they're just transferring it from another store in baltimore to hagerstown.

Oh well. I'll just get what I can for the '86. You guys don't happen to cut brake lines and stick fittings on them do you

[dcjredline]

Oh a store transfer? Did you pay? You shouldnt have had to. They can usually just refund you and just send it back when it arrives.

NOPE on the lines. I would HATE doing that crap for people too THANK GOD we dont.

But I wish someone would do the ones for the Blue Car.

[Tonglebeak]

Yes I already paid for it. I'll just go in then and get the refund, and order the 86 parts.

Do you know of any store that does stick fittings on a piece of brake line?

[dcjredline]

Here I do but its not a national chain or anything.

Parts Plus just incase you have one there.

[Tonglebeak]

Nope, don't have one here. Oh well.

mickstan, what are the specs on that brake line btw (how long/wide is it, what kind of fittings does it need, etc)?

I'm starting to feel like I'm screwing myself into a hole of lost money :(

[Slacker]

I had to redo part of my brake line on my chevy. You can just buy a length and diameter and rent the brake flaring tool from AZ (You get all your money refunded on the return and there's no time limit that I know of...) and do it yourself. It's a HUGE PITA and the lines like to split. :\

I'm not sure if the same can be said for that little section of line you need though.

[mickstan_VR]

That steel part of the brake hose is part of it. If you can get the hose, it'll come with the metal line already attached to it. The long,sort-of-straight metal brake LINE is a seperate part that connects to the hose thru a screw-together fitting. You need both parts.

Again, the BEST way to do this is to find a '86 STE with the rear disc brakes in a junkyard. You have to have the backing plates anyway, and they cannot be bought new anywhere. CAREFULLY remove all of the needed items from the doner car. Get the calipers and use them for a core charge for a NEW set. New calipers will save a LOT of heartache later. You can't get in a hurry on this. These are your brakes. Very important stuff. Take your time and do it right. If you can come up with the correct parts, I can walk you thru this.

[Tonglebeak]

That steel part of the brake hose is part of it. If you can get the hose, it'll come with the metal line already attached to it. The long,sort-of-straight metal brake LINE is a seperate part that connects to the hose thru a screw-together fitting. You need both parts.

Again, the BEST way to do this is to find a '86 STE with the rear disc brakes in a junkyard. You have to have the backing plates anyway, and they cannot be bought new anywhere. CAREFULLY remove all of the needed items from the doner car. Get the calipers and use them for a core charge for a NEW set. New calipers will save a LOT of heartache later. You can't get in a hurry on this. These are your brakes. Very important stuff. Take your time and do it right. If you can come up with the correct parts, I can walk you thru this.

Yeah I know I'm rushing this. Meh. I guess I can use the ebay calipers as a core lol.

I wanted to get this done before winter. Thanks to my laziness I kept putting it off.

How long is that separate brake line, and what's the diameter for it, etc etc so I can buy some and stick some fittings on them?

[mickstan_VR]

I do not know what the actual diminsions of the brake line are. And I would not try to make my own, especially if I had no experience at cutting, bending and flaring. If ya screw up and those lines leak, your car will not stop! You are going to have to go to a junkyard and find the parts.
And yeah, if those calipers are from an '88, they won't work on a non-ABS car. With the right parts in-hand, this is easy. Without the right parts, its a real nightmare.

[Tonglebeak]

Ok. It actually says 84-88, it's not specific. Bleh.

[dcjredline]

Wonder if these would fit on my Blue 89? If so I might be able to purchase them from ya.

[Tonglebeak]

I contacted the seller. This was his reply:



Dear tonglebeak,

they came off a 1986 Pontiac 6000 STE


- chevy_tpi

Also, I went junkyarding with my cousin today.

Out of that whole junkyard, there was only _ONE_ Pontiac 6000. It was a 1986 model...but not an STE.

wtf I'm kinda screwed here. We're going to try another junkyard (farther away) next weekend to see what we can find, but I'm starting to worry here. And I need to get that autozone crap taken care of tomorrow as well lol.

On that note, if ANYONE happens to come up with a set of backing plates and the brake lines, I will be more than happy to pay for the cost of them + shipping + cost for your labor in pulling them, gas, etc.

[mickstan_VR]

I'd be happy to help, but I'm strapped for time right now (remodel project at home). Don't get frustrated. They are out there. Be patient and you will find what you need.

[Tonglebeak]

Thanks. Hopefully the parts will come about one way or another. I just got the rotors today, and ordered the right parts from AZ today. The only thing that stands in my way are the backing plates and brake line.

BTW mickstan, what's your opinion on those calipers I got? The seller says they are indeed from an 86 ste (and no, I did not mention anything about 1986 to him).

[Electra_T_Type]

Are they different? I was under the impression that ABS was the same as non ABS stuff except the ABS cars had a dust shield.

[mickstan_VR]

They don't look look my calipers. Mine didn't have the big round thing on them, but they probably made different versions of the same thing. Hard to tell.....

[Tonglebeak]

I got them today. I'll take pics of them so we can verify this... :\

[Tonglebeak]

Mickstan, what's your impression on these:

http://img244.imageshack.us/img244/1397/dscn0718kw9.jpg

http://img244.imageshack.us/img244/9533/dscn0719fl6.jpg

[mickstan_VR]

They look like mine except for the big round thing connected to the e-brake lever. I would venture to say they are correct.

[Tonglebeak]

Cool :) Any idea what the big round thing is lol

[mickstan_VR]

Nope!

[Tonglebeak]

Unfortunately, I've put this on hold. I'm young (20), and hooking up with new girls have taken a higher priority >_____________>

[Tuddi]

Sooner or later you will discover that your cars, no matter how complicated in their behavior, are going to be more loyal and trustworthy than any of your girlfriends for the next 10 years.

... but then again, girls can do nice things our car's can't, so enjoy both worlds as much as you can - while you can!

[mickstan_VR]

Just think of all of the hot girls you'll pick up when they see those shiny rear disc brakes!

[notsoslimshady76]

Just think of all of the hot girls you'll pick up when they see those shiny rear disc brakes!

Maybe not.....FWIW, my girlfriend thinks the tire is attached to the hubcap which is attached to the car. Hubcaps and wheels are the same thing!

[Tonglebeak]

People just laugh at my car in all honesty. Until they hear what I have in the trunk, then they go "O_O"

[BBrip84Oatsie95]

oh, what percent tint is that, anyways?

[Tonglebeak]

32%. 35% is the legal, but I see so many people drive with 20% or even 5% and I get jealous >:(

I need a new paintjob. And a new passenger door, I think. It's rusting out at the bottom on both the cabin side and the outside. I got a few rust spots popping up on both rear quarter panels, but those are probably surface spots (hopefully). Although the paint is bubbling, so all of my hopes of it being a surface spot goes down the drain.

But first I have to get these rear brakes on. I've already invested 250 dollars into the parts for them.

And THEN I need a new exhaust before I die of carbon monoxide.

GAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH

I'm going to try to take better care of this thing. I get bored from redlining it anymore so I'll probably just try to keep it at around 30-35 for the 1-2 shift (redlines at 47).

I ALSO need new door handles (exterior). The ones there now rattle way too much from my subs, and they have little tension in them (springs are broken).

[BBrip84Oatsie95]

HEH! Cute list you've got there... And I have hit the same point with being nice to my car...:rolleyes:(first redlines at exactly 40, second at exactly 80. haven't checked after that, yet.)
Anyways, I need:

-New hubcaps(one broken, rest faded, etc)
-New paint job(clear coat in terrible condition, also have rust, several dents)
-I would like a tint
-Tires
-Window motors
-New windshield(cracked in 3 places, one about 11/2 ft long:eek:)
-I would like a CD player
-Drivers door handle(just hangin there, still works)
-Struts soon
-A number of random plastic pieces like the horn button, power seat switch surround, screw covers, reverse light reflector thing, rear name badge, etc etc
-Rear drivers side door panel(fasteners all F&*$ed up, window just jiggles around when its open)

Needed tune-up items:
EGR
O2
MAF
Coolant temp
IAC

I WIN!!! :D

And to top it all off, I got a $210 speeding ticket last night. Splendid. 85 in a 65. The guy was nice tho, he said I was really doing 91, but then I woulda hadta go to court! :eek:

[Tonglebeak]

There's screw covers made for these?

WHERE CAN I BUY SOME I HATE SEEING SCREWS ON MY DASH

[BBrip84Oatsie95]

Yeah, but they are really brittle plastic. Hence why I need a bunch of them. I have no idea where to get them other than a junkyard...

[mickstan_VR]

I would add transmissions to BOTH of your lists. LOL! 1st to 2nd gear shifts are handled by a friction material coated drum in the tranny. Its a very efficient and economical design, just not very durable. Not to mention what you're doing to the axles. Oh the things people do to thier cars.....

[Tonglebeak]

I have plenty of faith in the th125c though :)

[BBrip84Oatsie95]

What exactly am I doing to the axles?

[LordDurock]

HEH! Cute list you've got there... And I have hit the same point with being nice to my car...:rolleyes:(first redlines at exactly 40, second at exactly 80. haven't checked after that, yet.)
Anyways, I need:

-New hubcaps(one broken, rest faded, etc)
-New paint job(clear coat in terrible condition, also have rust, several dents)
-I would like a tint
-Tires
-Window motors
-New windshield(cracked in 3 places, one about 11/2 ft long:eek:)
-I would like a CD player
-Drivers door handle(just hangin there, still works)
-Struts soon
-A number of random plastic pieces like the horn button, power seat switch surround, screw covers, reverse light reflector thing, rear name badge, etc etc
-Rear drivers side door panel(fasteners all F&*$ed up, window just jiggles around when its open)

Needed tune-up items:
EGR
O2
MAF
Coolant temp
IAC

I WIN!!! :D

And to top it all off, I got a $210 speeding ticket last night. Splendid. 85 in a 65. The guy was nice tho, he said I was really doing 91, but then I woulda hadta go to court! :eek:


no i win just dont get me started..............:) i need almost all of that and a few more things :) like a bumper and a read qouter panle and a drives door.............

[LordDurock]

no i win just dont get me started..............:) i need almost all of that and a few more things :) like a bumper and a read qouter panle and a drives door.............

oh a lot of tlc on the break system

[mickstan_VR]

What exactly am I doing to the axles?

Destroying them. :(
keep it up and they'll going clickclickclickclickclickclickclickclickclick :)

[86euro]

I'm a little late, but I have some info to add concerning the rear disc. The '88 parts WILL, I repeat, WILL work. That's what I used on my '86. The only differences were just add-ons to the earlier parts. The wheel bearings have a reluctor added ring and can be used, or the original bearing can be used. The caliper brackets have a dust shield attached and can be left in place, just leave off the abs sensor. The only difference in the calipers is the ring on the e-brake lever, which is either a damper, or a weight to help the lever release. The '86 and earlier ja2 master cylinder also works well with the rear discs for those of you with the older models.
They do work awesome and are worth the upgrade. My only complaint is, the crappy pad retainers. The factory ones were worn out (I guess) and the pads rattled over bumps. I ordered new ones from napa that are a different design, but they suck too and won't stay attached. I plan to install some Wilwood residual pressure valves inline for both rear brakes. They will hold 2psi of pressure into the caliper which should be enough to keep the pads from rattling. They should improve the pedal height too. No amount of bleeding or parking brake use seems to help.

[mickstan_VR]

hmmm thats odd. I have no rattle issues with mine at all. I just used the stock retainers that came with the autozone calipers.They were a bear to get lined up, but they seem to work ok. You are talking about the rings with the little tangs on them right?
By the way, welcome back!

[86euro]

Yes, the rings with the little tangs on them. They held the pads on, but the rings themselves were able to move around in the grove on the piston. I replaced those with a version that napa sells that is a wire clip that snaps around the piston. The pad then hooks into the clip. They were a b**** to install, and after a day or so, they let go of the pad. I bought another set and had the exact same issues.
I thought about buying loaded calipers with the pads and hoping that they were already installed, but I don't know:(

[Tonglebeak]

Just a quick question for others with the rear discs: do you notice any kind of rubbing/dragging noise when applying the brakes? I hear them coming from both sides. Perhaps I forgot to put some caliper lube behind the pads? (I have other things to worry about, my brake fluid is magically disappearing and I bet it's disappearing yet again through my left-front caliper...for whatever reason I just CANNOT get that leak to go away).

[86euro]

No funny noises from mine. Just a slightly low pedal that I believe is due to the rear calipers not staying adjusted.

[Pontiac6ksteawd]

The rear cals are really easy to adjust...

Leaving the caliper attached to the car, take the ebrake cable off, wrench the arm with a tool of some sort about 10 times. Reinstall the E-brake cable. and your done.

Can you describe the noise? or maybe get a video of it..

[Tonglebeak]

It just sounds like the pads are dragging along the rotors, no other way to really put it. It's not too loud so I don't know if I'll be able to get a video of it...