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Dust Buster Race Car...help needed

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    #91
    From what I remember, the oil pan does have a tray in it to keep the oil from sloshing around too much. I also remember having to lower the crossmember down some to remove the pan.

    And the trans lines are standard SAE flare.
    -Andy

    '86 Eurosport VR coupe
    '86 Eurosport sedan
    '88 Eurosport VR coupe
    '89 Eurosport wagon

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      #92
      As always guys, thanks for all the help.

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        #93
        Wahoo! We have a 1995 Lumina APV parts van! Anyone want burgundy interior bits.

        I am thinking we will keep:

        The entire subframe and everything attached to it
        rear springs (for playing wiht lower strategies)
        The ECU and maybe the rear suspension/hubs (if they work for the Uplander disc conversion)
        Wiper arms and motor

        What else?

        Cat goes to the specialty recycler
        Rest of the body wheels and various steel bits from the race van go to the bulk scrap yard

        It is actually kind of sad as not much is wrong with the van (may change once we get under it) and the body is in good shape. Interior is not trashed but has some (probably common issue). Except for the same excessive pulling the other van had, it drives pretty good too. Alas, we need the spare subframe and overall this is likely cheaper than the PnP and we get to test everything first!

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          #94
          Figured I would show you the final product before we drive it in anger this weekend...

          Click image for larger version

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          It is not wearing its 16" wheels and racing tires in the pic but the Dust Buster will hit the track Friday (test and tune) for the first time and race Saturday and Sunday (hopefully) for 14 hours.

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            #95
            And the Dustbuster is VICTORIOUS! We won the highest prize in LeMons, the Index of Effluence. Some coverage:

            From BS, to end of day one to WINNERS!

            We think they liked us…
            http://blog.caranddriver.com/lemons-...baru-xt-turbo/

            We know they liked us and showed us leading the race…it is an illusion:
            http://blog.caranddriver.com/lemons-...ds-day-in-dfl/

            We are the last mentioned because we won the HIGHEST prize in LeMons
            http://blog.caranddriver.com/24-hour...the-winners-3/

            Now we have to go about sorting the Van for true 24 hours at the end of July. The laundry list is long for the amount of time left but not all that hard:

            Get "real" endurance pads
            Fix charging system and probably bad ground on tranny cooler gauge
            Lower rear suspension
            Lower front suspension
            Install additional lights and wire relays to control
            Baffle oil pan
            Install hydration system
            Investigate the clunk under weight transfer that sounds like something binding
            Transponder mount
            Fuel gauge troubleshooting
            Theme

            Nice to have:
            Passenger window electric drive (fixed!)
            Less restrictive seat
            Replace side and rear glass with Plexiglas
            Brake cooling ducts (I still think heat was not our primary issue)
            Improve the gopro mount (a full-sized VHS camcorder likes to move around)
            Use "rated" transmission cooler line for all tranny cooler hoses
            Put new crank and rod bearings in the motor currently in the van
            Install rear sway bar (or build one if it never ships)

            We look forward input on the suspension set-up side.

            Comment


              #96
              Front struts get clunky when they're worn out. The struts themselves are shared between the vans and cars, but the springs are van-only. For the rear, get a hold of coils from a Lumina APV cargo van and a set of Monroe 58427 shocks. Rock Auto has them for about $63 or so for the pair. They have a 25 lb helper spring around them, designed for carrying heavier loads, and have stiffened up the rear of my wagon appreciably. I would advise against a sway bar.

              Replace the bushings for the front sway bar. There are four, one on each side where it bolts to the control arms, and two in the subframe.

              As for the brakes, since you already have 16" wheels, use Camaro brakes. Get the caliper brackets from a 98-02 F-body at a yard if you can. Buy the calipers and pads new for a 98-02 F-body, and rotors for a 00-05 Impala.

              Transmission! Get one with a 3.33 ratio to replace your 3.05. A '95 Lumina or Monte Carlo should have one, and will be a drop-in. I think they're even wired the same, and being a '95, the computer shouldn't care too much about the different final drive. Edit to add: Looking back at the thread, I said earlier that the computer would flip out if you put in a 3.33 transmission. Further research indicates that only the OBD2 computers care about that, so a '95 shouldn't.

              Prices from Rock Auto:
              Moog CC667 rear variable rate springs, $61
              Monroe 58427 load-assist shocks, $63
              Last edited by Duke George V; 05-01-2015, 12:46 AM.
              Daniel
              Kaiser George IX: 1996 Buick Century Special wagon. 214-SFI. 227k miles. Never gonna give you up, never gonna let you down. First documented LX9 swap in an A-body! Click here to read my build thread!
              Goldilocks: 1992 Buick Century Special sedan. 204-MFI. 132k miles.
              Susana: 1993 Buick Century Custom wagon. 204-MFI. 121k miles. No longer with us.

              Comment


                #97
                Originally posted by Duke George V View Post
                Front struts get clunky when they're worn out. The struts themselves are shared between the vans and cars, but the springs are van-only. rear, get a hold of coils from a Lumina APV cargo van and a set of Monroe 58427 shocks. Rock Auto has them for about $63 or so for the pair. They have a 25 lb helper spring around them, designed for carrying heavier loads, and have stiffened up the rear of my wagon appreciably. I would advise against a sway bar.
                If anything I think this will make our problem worse. We need to drop the rear (and the front) of the vehicle at least 3" from the post-gutted ride height (this ride height was at least an inch higher in the rear than before the vehicle was gutted). If anything we need a 2-3" shorter coil so that when under the weight of the car (full sag) we are sitting 2" lower than stock ride height. The total coil "load" is actually OK, just need it a lot shorter with a shorter shock (so the springs won't jump out of the perches and the stroke utilizes the low and high speed damping correctly).

                The front needs both stiffer and lower.

                In the end we need to drop the CG and roll center as much as reasonable and for the track we only need about 4" of wheel travel...now loading it on the trailer we could always use more but that is a different issue.

                Comment


                  #98
                  Originally posted by Duke George V View Post
                  As for the brakes, since you already have 16" wheels, use Camaro brakes. Get the caliper brackets from a 98-02 F-body at a yard if you can. Buy the calipers and pads new for a 98-02 F-body, and rotors for a 00-05 Impala.
                  On this part, what do we gain exactly (still a GM newbie) over the "big brakes" that came on the 1995? I ask mostly because the enormous full-sized banana pads on the stock brakes have limited our pad selection (none of the Raybestos racing compounds are available). At least in the images on Amazon, these appear to be the same design so I am guessing the major difference would be a slightly larger rotor?

                  Comment


                    #99
                    Originally posted by OnkelUdo View Post
                    On this part, what do we gain exactly (still a GM newbie) over the "big brakes" that came on the 1995? I ask mostly because the enormous full-sized banana pads on the stock brakes have limited our pad selection (none of the Raybestos racing compounds are available). At least in the images on Amazon, these appear to be the same design so I am guessing the major difference would be a slightly larger rotor?
                    Call up Porterfield and they should be able to get you racing pads. I normally go through Topbrakes they stock portfield r4 and hawk blue. I'm sure Porterfield can make r4e too. If you went to the rs camaro brakes (your already use the same pages as the later v6 camero atleast) you will probably get just about any pads already made and ready to ship out.
                    Racing 4 Nickels

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                      Ended up just ordering Carbotech XP8's for the brakes we have.

                      On the suspension side I think I found a compatible shock for the rear with 2" less length and 1.5" less stroke that uses (essentially) the same top and bottom connection. It is out of a crapload of 1985-1995 Mercedes sedans and coupes.

                      Still working on the front but a 1995-1999 Neon strut is looking promising (have to take some measurements at the PnP). It is the same body style and as long as knuckle flange opening is wide enough we can weld up bigger flanges. It is about 2" shorter and 1.25" less stroke. We will have to get creative on the spring but we can start with the stock Neon spring and move up from there (or do a coil-over conversion).

                      Comment


                        Short fuse on this one so any answers appreciated. The KYB 234019 Excel-G shows only compatible with the Trans Sport through 1993. We are looking for ANY upgrade from the Monroe for our psuedo coil-over conversion but ours is a 1995. Will it work? Will it work with a strut bearing from a 1993?

                        Our suspension guru thinks the solution is to use 3" "Stock Car" springs and by his description, I agree.

                        The rear is now dropped 2" from stock (3" from race weight) and it is honestly about right but the truth is in the driving.
                        Last edited by OnkelUdo; 05-16-2015, 11:19 PM.

                        Comment


                          Originally posted by OnkelUdo View Post
                          Short fuse on this one so any answers appreciated. The KYB 234019 Excel-G shows only compatible with the Trans Sport through 1993. We are looking for ANY upgrade from the Monroe for our psuedo coil-over conversion but ours is a 1995. Will it work? Will it work with a strut bearing from a 1993?

                          Our suspension guru thinks the solution is to use 3" "Stock Car" springs and by his description, I agree.

                          The rear is now dropped 2" from stock (3" from race weight) and it is honestly about right but the truth is in the driving.
                          All the shock and struts I see on rock auto work from 90-96 or the whole run. 94 may have been when they changed the front brakes to the larger ones which have no bearing at all on the struts but maybe they never verified or something like that so they don't list it. Pretty sure its the same so a strut bearing from 93 is the strut bearing from 95.
                          Racing 4 Nickels

                          Comment


                            The Monroe "monotube" style struts ended up in front and we now have 500#/inch stock car springs, about 1.5" shorter than stock, on modified perches and mounts. It still looks high in the front but a measurement from the pinch weld to ground verifies that we are sitting almost dead level with the 1.5 coils cut off the rears.

                            The van really is coming together but lordy we need a test drive of all these mods.

                            Comment


                              Originally posted by OnkelUdo View Post
                              On this part, what do we gain exactly (still a GM newbie) over the "big brakes" that came on the 1995? I ask mostly because the enormous full-sized banana pads on the stock brakes have limited our pad selection (none of the Raybestos racing compounds are available). At least in the images on Amazon, these appear to be the same design so I am guessing the major difference would be a slightly larger rotor?
                              Sorry, I missed this. The Impala rotors are larger, so they can dissipate more heat when braking, and they share the 5 x 115 lug spacing with the van. The Camaro calipers are two piston instead of the single piston on the van, so you get more (and more even) clamping force. Also, you then have the whole selection of pads for the Camaro.
                              Daniel
                              Kaiser George IX: 1996 Buick Century Special wagon. 214-SFI. 227k miles. Never gonna give you up, never gonna let you down. First documented LX9 swap in an A-body! Click here to read my build thread!
                              Goldilocks: 1992 Buick Century Special sedan. 204-MFI. 132k miles.
                              Susana: 1993 Buick Century Custom wagon. 204-MFI. 121k miles. No longer with us.

                              Comment


                                Originally posted by Duke George V View Post
                                Sorry, I missed this. The Impala rotors are larger, so they can dissipate more heat when braking, and they share the 5 x 115 lug spacing with the van. The Camaro calipers are two piston instead of the single piston on the van, so you get more (and more even) clamping force. Also, you then have the whole selection of pads for the Camaro.
                                Hey Duke, I'm a little confused here... If I understand it right, you're saying that '98-'02 2-piston (PBR-style) Camaro front brake calipers will bolt onto the newer (large brake) U-Van front knuckle? I know in the past, folks that were upgrading their earlier ('93-'97) Camaro single-piston front brakes to the larger, better ('98-'02) versions needed to swap out the front spindles from the '98-'02 as the caliper mounting abutments were completely different between the generations. I remember holding the parts together in the junkyard (a '01 Camaro front brake caliper, up to a '96 U-Van spindle and then to a '92-'97 Camaro spindle) and I couldn't see it happening without U-Van spindle modification (mainly grinding off the old caliper nub and an adapter bracket). Is there an aftermarket bracket (designed for a '93-'97 Camaro) available to do this? Just trying to straighten this out in my mind, because '98-'02 Camaro front brakes/calipers would be perfect for what I'm planning to do with my Celebrity and would go with the 11" rear '05 Uplander brakes I have, muhahaha.
                                1985 Chevy Celebrity Sedan (2.8-X, THM125, JA2, F41)
                                1954 Chevy 3100 Pickup (235 I-6, SM420)
                                1994 Toyota Camry LE Coupe (2.2, A140)

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