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Adding a factory-type Temp gauge and 3-wire Coolant Temp Sensor...

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  • Zaloryan
    replied
    Okay, a TU66 sender. How will I get a correct connecting plug-in to the switch?

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  • turbokinetic
    replied
    According to the 1990 Ciera 3.3L wiring diagram, your warning light is controlled by the engine ECM. The only green wire under the hood going to a temperature sender should be for a gauge sender.

    I beleive the warning light signal comes from the ECM on terminal F2.

    Try a TU66 sender in place of your existing switch.

    If you ground this wire and the gauge moves, you definately need to install the TU66 sender in place of whatever you have in there now.

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  • turbokinetic
    replied
    Ok - here's a test. Have you tried to disconnect the green wire from the temp switch and ground it? What happens? Does this illuminate a warning lamp, or does it make the gange pointer move?

    If the gauge pointer moves, then you have a SWITCH installed in place of a SENDER. Probably an error on the part of the parts store employee who looked it up for you.

    If a light illuminates, they you need to search for another green wire in the harness. Does your manual (the one you go to repair the engine) show the wiring diagram for the gauges cluster?


    David



    Ps- Looks like my IP address is now fixed. Above is the repost of the senders picture since the IP changed again.

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  • Zaloryan
    replied
    Everything works except the temperature gauge.

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  • turbokinetic
    replied
    Does your car have a gauge in the cluster that is not connected?

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  • Zaloryan
    replied
    I guess what the dilemma is where exactly I put it. Next to the temperature sensor, there is a 'plugged' hole. It is plugged with a 'plug' (lol) that threads into the space that I believe the gauge switch goes. Problem is, I don't know where the pigtail is that connects to it!

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  • Zaloryan
    replied
    As far as sensor, the one that was on my engine looks like the pic you posted on the bottom right. Oval connection, check.

    Now, concerning the gauge 'switch' (?) it most closely resembles the center bottom picture, with a black plastic "cup" surrounding the metal connection. I'll see if I can post a picture shortly.

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  • turbokinetic
    replied
    There is a temp SENSOR (note the spelling) with an oval 2-pin connector. It should have a black and a yellow wire. This is for the ECM and has nothing to do with the gauges.

    There is a temp switch used for cooling fans. You car should not have this. It has a round "mushroom shaped" connecor with one teminal inside.

    There is a temp switch for an idiot light that has a square /rectangle connector with one wire.

    There is a temp sender (note spelling) for the gauge, which usually has one flat terminal.

    It's easy to tell a gauge sender from a warning light switch. Use an digital ohm meter, and measure from the threaded base of the device to the terminal. A warning light switch will show "OL" and this reading will not change. A gauge sender will show resistance, that will be slowly decreasing as the sender responds to your heat as you hold it.

    In a nutshell: If you get "OL" it is a light switch; if you get "numbers" it is a gauge sender.

    Hope this helps! The following list is not all inclusive and only inclused items I have used on my projects.

    David



    Ps- all the pictures I have posted in the past are not showing beccause the telco lost my static IP address when the power company trenched the line in half.

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  • Zaloryan
    replied
    Help!

    I just got my new oil pressure gauge sensor in. I put in a new temp sensor too, but it turns out it was the exact same sensor that I had in before! I got another sensor, also supposedly for a gauge, but the connector is round with one metal connection. The sensor on my 3.3 v6 has an oval connector with two metal connections. Do I actually have the right sensor? Because the thread seems larger than it should in diameter! Does it go somewhere else? I sure can't find a round connector for another temp sensor anywhere. My factory service manual and haynes are actually leaving me hanging for once!

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  • turbokinetic
    replied
    Neither did I until I tried it and measured the results! Live and learn!

    If anyone wants a temp vs. resistance table for the panel gauge side of this sensor, I can post it. Goes from 44 to 215°F but will give you an idea if yours is close.

    David

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  • notsoslimshady76
    replied
    Nice! I didn't know a three wire coolant sensor worked with our ECMs/ clusters

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  • turbokinetic
    replied
    You are correct about the high reading in the head. It does show a little hotter than the ECM data but still stays in the normal range of the gauge. On the Century cluster, 220 is straight-up on the gauge, and it never goes above that unless the fan is not working or there is another problem.

    There _MAY_ be a difference in this dead spot in the iron head vs. aluminum head engines, mine is iron. My turbo 60° motor has never had a chronic overheating problem, real or imagined.

    The 3-gauge idea would be interesting. My TechEdge datalogger could do 3 or more sensors at the same time. As if I don't have enough projects already!

    Before I went MPFI / Turbo on this motor, the sender was in the thermostat housing. I had a heater hose pop off while I was in a store. I started the engine and left with no coolant in the engine. About 2 or 3 minutes later, I hear pinging in the engine, look down and the gauge is in the normal area.

    Knowing there was something wrong (due to the pinging and power loss) I pulled off, stopped the engine and opened the hood. As I was pulling over, the gauge was at 3/4 scale (high normal). Been driving at 65 MPH for 4 to 5 minutes w/o coolant.

    I saw what happened but the engine was too hot to work on. It was smoking from all over and I could feel heat radiating so I sat down in the car waiting for it to cool off. When I turned the key back ON (without starting), the gauge was over past 280.

    Over the next minute it went so far past 280 that the needle was not visible in the instrument panel!!!

    This episode damaged the engine and it had piston slap (knocking) from that point until the rebuild and turbo install.

    After this I moved the sensor to the rear head and it has worked better since that. One time the lower radiator hose blew off, and it immediately responded and hit 250 by the time I stopped (less than a mile) Never went off-scale after shutdown, maybe hit 280 before it started cooling off.

    In my opinion; the water outlet where you get a better true reading from both banks, it is the place for the ECM sensor. But for fastest response in abnormal operating conditioins, the heads are a safer location for the warning sensor.

    If you had a dummy light and a gauge, you might put the dummy light switch in the head and the gauge sender in the water outlet with the ECM sensor?

    Interesting points!

    Thanks,
    David

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  • mickstan_VR
    replied
    David, your temp guage location theory is all good except that on these 60 degree motors you can get a false reading in the head. The guage will read hotter than it actually is because of the design of the head. There is a "dead" spot where the sensor goes. Poor coolant circulation in that area. You can get a more accurate, balanced reading of whats going on in both heads from the water neck area. Thats where the ecm is getting its readings from anyway.
    I know its overkill, but 3 temp guages, one in the left head, one in the right, and one at the neck would give the best readings. It would be interesting to see, but a pita to do!

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  • turbokinetic
    replied
    I thought all the diesels had a temp gauge. Guess I'm wrong?

    The wiring diagram worked out OK except one ground was bad in the car's harness. After I fixed that everything worked.

    David

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  • LordDurock
    replied
    errr..................so it looks like i have to do work to do a swaps............thats sad. oh well great job any ways. it looks nice

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